UK VIOLENT CRIME STATS HIGHER THAN SOUTH AFRICA
Oooh! GOTTA hurt!
7.07.2009Wow, this is something to add to the voices in your head asking why exactly you live in London.
A recent study has found that violent crime is higher in the UK per capita, than it is in South Africa.
This, from the Daily Mail :
The most violent country in Europe: Britain is also worse than South Africa and U.S.
Britain’s violent crime record is worse than any other country in the European union, it has been revealed.
Official crime figures show the UK also has a worse rate for all types of violence than the U.S. and even South Africa – widely considered one of the world’s most dangerous countries.
The figures comes on the day new Home Secretary Alan Johnson makes his first major speech on crime, promising to be tough on loutish behaviour.
Nice vibe
The Tories said Labour had presided over a decade of spiralling violence.
In the decade following the party’s election in 1997, the number of recorded violent attacks soared by 77 per cent to 1.158million – or more than two every minute.
The figures, compiled from reports released by the European Commission and United Nations, also show:
* The UK has the second highest overall crime rate in the EU.
* It has a higher homicide rate than most of our western European neighbours, including France, Germany, Italy and Spain.
* The UK has the fifth highest robbery rate in the EU.
* It has the fourth highest burglary rate and the highest absolute number of burglaries in the EU, with double the number of offences than recorded in Germany and France.But it is the naming of Britain as the most violent country in the EU that is most shocking. The analysis is based on the number of crimes per 100,000 residents.
In the UK, there are 2,034 offences per 100,000 people, way ahead of second-placed Austria with a rate of 1,677.
The U.S. has a violence rate of 466 crimes per 100,000 residents, Canada 935, Australia 92 and South Africa 1,609.
Shadow Home Secretary Chris Grayling said: ‘This is a damning indictment of this government’s comprehensive failure over more than a decade to tackle the deep rooted social problems in our society, and the knock on effect on crime and anti-social behaviour.
[And so it goes on. Click here to read more.]
That must really anger the naysayers out there who love nothing better than talking about how “bad things are back home” as we head towards being “another Zimbabwe.”
Whatever.
[thanks chad]
July 7th, 2009 at 7:58 am
one has to wonder though…are their violent crimes as violent as ours?
do they kill for a cellphone as often as us? are their rapes of babies as high as ours?
nice not to be first on the list and hopefully others just look at the figures and no further.
July 7th, 2009 at 8:22 am
Uhhhh…have to agree with you there Johan,lets not forget that at least 50% of our seriously violent crimes go unreported together with the fact that rape,grand theft auto,high-jackings,armed robbery etc, are considered a LITTLE less serious than those of a more mundane nature that are reported and listed in the EU.
That said,I remain positive and will NOT leave.
July 7th, 2009 at 8:30 am
Im sure if the UK police had guns instead of batons and whistles the crime rate would be lower. But screw the UK, SA will take gold next time…
July 7th, 2009 at 8:45 am
Wasn’t it Mark Twain who said something like: “In life you get lies, damn lies, and statistics” ?
I’d like to see those stats broken down according to things like:
1. What types of crimes are being compared. (Am sure that the crimes that “qualify” for the categories differ from country to country.)
2. Violent crimes on strangers vs violent crimes where the victim knows the perpetrator.
3. Are murders included or are they a separate category? Because if not and if more violent crimes result in murder in one country, then the violent crime stats will be reduced and the murders will go up correspondingly.
Am not a statistician or a criminologist, so I’ve probably missed a ton of things one needs to compare and control in a study like this in order to be able to derive meaningful comparisons. But I’d like to see the basis of this study. Am confident that the Daily Mail trades in sensation not hard science.
I’m also not disputing their statements, but I’m remarking that their statements are unqualified and without understanding the basis, they could potentially be extremely misleading compared with the conclusions one could derive when one gets down to the detail.
July 7th, 2009 at 8:46 am
Cut the bullshit out of the local police reports and our stats will require a digit or two more on that spreadsheet. My place was recently burgled and the cops asked me ” are you sure you want to report it? ..oh,you are insured.., sure, ok.” This after I had to wait for an hour for the freaking patrol van to pitch.
July 7th, 2009 at 8:49 am
not to be negative after only my first cup of coffee,…… but SA crime figures are grossly understated,…. what do you expect when half of government probably did not pass math on Standard Grade…… I definitely dont buy it!
July 7th, 2009 at 8:50 am
look beyond the negative. there is so much to be greatful for in SA. crime is everywhere. violent crime more so. be part of the solution and take steps to change it as I have and stop bitching like so many others
July 7th, 2009 at 8:54 am
Check out the Hayibo article on the latest crime stats: http://www.hayibo.com/articles/view/1077
July 7th, 2009 at 9:06 am
If you look at the report in detail you’ll see that in the UK things like noise disturbance is classified as a violent crime, so this inflates the stats.
Although its a good talking point, at the end of the day we all know that SA has some of the world’s worst crime rates, especially violent crime.
I live in SA though (moved back from the UK last yr), so not putting it down, just saying that we need to stop lying to ourselves.
July 7th, 2009 at 9:26 am
Living in South Africa is exciting – you HAVE to live for every moment, because it COULD be your last.
I will not accept that the Poms can beat us at anything. South Africa rocks.
July 7th, 2009 at 9:57 am
Comparing stats across countries is very misleading, but it is “interesting” that SA is used as the benchmark for violent crime, when we aren’t the worst in the world.
Have a look at this: http://www.sagoodnews.co.za/newsletter_archive/managing_perceptions_a_lesson_from_brazil.html
July 7th, 2009 at 10:00 am
There’s a follow up article somewhere on The Times website.
This article is all about the Torries trying to make labour look bad.
They discussed this yesterday on 567 with a guy who does crime analysis.
The UK has 400 odd knife related murders per year where has South Africa has 6000 odd. You can’t even begin to compare the levels of violent crimes in the two countries.
July 7th, 2009 at 10:45 am
Having lived in the UK for a couple years as many S.Africans do I can only arrive at one conclusion. The UK is a great experience but SA is so much better, yes we have our problems but guess what so does everywhere else. I’m a patriotic South African right to the end. (and no I am not black as the name suggests)
July 7th, 2009 at 10:50 am
I call bullshit. Complete and utter bullshit.
The Daily Mail is a bottom-feeding paper on a par with the tabloids. They are probably comparing completely different statistics.
Why not look up some reputable statistics, like The Economist Intelligence unit’s peace index:
http://www.visionofhumanity.org/gpi/results/world-map.php
July 7th, 2009 at 10:57 am
So the SA youngsters moving to the UK made SA a safer place, and the UK more dangerous?
July 7th, 2009 at 11:33 am
These figures are complete bulls#!t, it is the usual sensationalist journalism that has little basis in the truth, the original report comes from the Daily Mail in the UK, nuff said!
July 7th, 2009 at 11:45 am
More than 50 rape cases – some involving children as young as four – were never noted or investigated by police in the Western Cape because the police did not want their crime statistics to look bad, Community Safety MEC Lennit Max told the news media this week.
This makes me wonder how accurate these stats are anyway…..
July 7th, 2009 at 12:21 pm
Another statistic to back up my earlier comments: murder stats UK: 1.5/100,000 SA: 39/100,000 and as noted by other commentators, our stats are probably worse, STOP irresponsible journalism!
July 7th, 2009 at 12:47 pm
Hi
I would just like to point you to our goverments website as well as the U.K goverment website for crime.
South africa – http://www.saps.gov.za/statistics/reports/crimestats/2008/crime_stats_2008.htm
uk – http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/rds/crimeew0708.html (page 64)
If we look at murder alone in 2007/2008 the U.K had a total of 1404 murders where as we had 18000 murders. baring in mind too that we have roughly the same population.
I hardly see how we can be at a lower rate than them when this does not even consider other crimes.
July 7th, 2009 at 3:32 pm
At least we are allowed to carry arms and defend ourselves in SA… Try using *any* object to defend yourself during an attack in the UK and YOU will be charged for assult!
July 7th, 2009 at 3:46 pm
Nice headline, but read the article! SA has 20 000 murders a year, compared with the UK’s 900 odd in 2007.
Definition of violent crime is slightly grey here.
July 8th, 2009 at 8:56 pm
UK murder rate is relatively low compared to places like the U.S or S.A.
This said UK is an extremily violent place during friday and saturday nights. Its alcohol fueled violence and it happens everywhere, so much so that it could brake the NHS, they simply cannot cope with the number of casualties.
A family outing a few yrs ago to a local restaurant led to my 70yr old Dad being repeatedly beaten up with nuckle dusters by a gang of 20 kids, they threw my mum infront of a car and made me and my brother watch. All of this happened 2 mins from the restaurant on the high street, people knew them but the police didn’t care / follow it up. To them this is minor they can’t afford the police time.
Seperate occasion, I was beaten up by a gang of young men who pissed on me, knocked me out and repeatedly stamped on my head (caught on CCTV), now I have brain damage and have had to leave university, the main guy who attacked me was also a student, he received a £250 fine and a slap on the wrist.
I have also been attacked on seperate occasions. I am not small, 6ft2, was well built.
There is no way you can’t say the UK is a violent dangerous place simply because the murder rates are fairly low, people are recieving seriously debilitating disabilities that the stats simply don’t pick up!
UK is such a binge drinking culture, fighting is a past time before the last attack when I used to go out drinking at night (don’t anymore) I have on several occasions had people come up to me and politely ask, do you want to have a fight, I would say no, and I watched the idiot casually go up to someone else who agreed, I watched this well spoken man, split second turn into a psycho, I also got attacked once on my birthday, I told him it was my birthday and the idiot shook my hand, wished me happy birthday and then went and started a fight with someone else.
Its a bloody violent alcohol fueled culture.
July 8th, 2009 at 9:08 pm
I had been out in my places around the world including a lot of places in the US. The main thing I noticed was people simply don’t drink as heavily, you get the odd ones but most people have a reasonable handle on it. I never saw a fight abroad other than when I went to Brit hot spots.
Regarding street gang knifing and shootings, yes you get lots more in the US, SA and mainy other places, these things happen here and I definately wouldn’t want to be on the recieving end as the consequences would be equal wherever but the rate of this kind of attack is milder.
British main violence is alcohol street fighting, most of them have no idea how dangerous fighting can be, brain damage, blindness, paralysis are all things that happen in large numbers every single weekend, theres no such thing as rough area, safe area, everywhere is a rough area on the weekends!
July 16th, 2009 at 12:44 pm
I’m South African and currently living in Sydney. I’ve lived in the UK for a few years too. Crime is definitely on the increase in the UK and even here in Oz. But sadly, we are just deluding ourselves to really believe that crime in the UK is worse than in SA. The level of violent crime in SA is just shocking and I don’t believe any country in the world, not taking into account those that are war torn and so forth, can have such a high crime rate that SA has. It cannot be
July 17th, 2009 at 7:23 pm
Yeah, like I said UK murder rates are fairly low compared to U.S S.A or many other places. But its the alcohol violence. S.A is a bloody violent place but its out of necessity. @Large poverty means people go out mugging. In the UK, there is a social service / benefits. So there is no necessity to mug. your provided the basics if needed. You get muggings but its more for greed, people that want extra money for drugs or whatever.
I think UK is fairly safe unless its friday or saturday night, or if your in a drinking area on other nights. Then its bloody violent, its a passed time for so many people and it doesn’t matter what your qualifications or social standing is. Even professions will get involved in fights when there drunk.
I think one of the reasons the murder rate is low in the UK is because the UK is the servailance capital of the world. 90% of all murders are baught to justice and criminals no this. They no they will get life. In S.A many murders only get 5yrs so its less of a risk plus the lack of servailance makes it much easier to get away with murder.
I think cameras are a good thing as I am sure that if we didn’t have most places under servailance our murder rates would be higher.